Exactly. Some people probably aren't playing on modified servers hosting more than the usual 4 players.

thank you for being someone who actually understands

Wrong. Have run this in a vanilla server many many times without issue, beginning to end. Only online. Only vanilla. No mods. No skins.

Ratman... notice you said "vanilla". Now read what Redd said... there's a difference between server types. I'm now convinced you don't thoroughly what I say or anyone else and only defend originals and only here to hate on Huck.

With all due respect you need to read a little more carefully, Ratman. "Vanilla"... "no mods". However, you do play online, so that's a start. Many people enjoy playing with modifications, servers included.

Also, Rat, I saw your other comment all the way down below and replied. They seem out of order for some reason. So I hope you don't miss it and get too upset before reading it, heh. (that's not meant as a jab, by the way).

I heard that the problem occurs when the map is played with more than 4 people, well you cant blame the map if thats the case. Im sure many more maps will have issues if you increase player limit if the map is only suited for 4 players. Would it make it justifiable to reupload to cater to those specific people?

Yes you can blame the map if removing something form it solves the problem. Entities are a map thing. If a server has too much to load, that's where the problem lies. All a server does is host the content and the players. You kind of contradict yourself there, Andre. But I'll give the one point about justifiable, but that's what the thing is... many authors aren't around any more. If the problems are so easily fixable by others, and the crediting remains and the site's fine with it, well then so be it. Authors can always come back and request the content to be removed but that doesn't happen because they're long gone.

Either you dont get what im saying or you're simply twisting what I said. The game is meant to be played with 4 people (8 if versus is taken into account). Many maps here are made and tested to work fine in vanilla. Why vanilla? BECAUSE THATS HOW THE GAME IS SUPPOSED TO BE PLAYED. When someone complains about a custom map on this site and the workshop about bugs or errors, a responsible author who tests his work will say to disable other addons even if it doesnt conflict in the addon menu. He would know what his own map would work best on. By your logic, it's the map's fault for not being able to work with every configuration in existence, which justifies Huck's action of 'fixing' it. If you try to load custom maps on a 8v8 VS custom server with perks and other scripts then of course you'll get some problems with the map. Are you saying Huck should remove entities until it works on that server? Instead of blaming the map, shouldnt you blame the players and server for stretching the limits of the source engine? You're right when you say that most authors arent around anymore. But what makes you think problems are easily fixable by someone not involved in the original creation of the map? Since he couldnt ask the original author, how does he know he didnt change something important? It's a risk to take over someone else's map, and you can see the community's reaction to that.

and who says you can't modify the game and have to only play it vanilla? that is definitely YOUR opinion. yet here we are, on a site where you can download mods and maps to customize the game. there are even places to go to get your own modified dedicated server and plugins for it. many server owners and admins come here for the same content. it has often been discovered that it is indeed the fault of certain maps and what authors try to do with them that cause problems. they will often push limits of the source engine. dead before dawn was a great example with its history. i won't explain to you what exactly entities are, you probably won't care or understand, but it simply removing them helps then that' the way it is. it's not the player's fault, it is a combination of the maps and server, but mostly the maps. modified servers will often run the stock maps just fine with more players. to a certain extent, the only big issue with the server is the hosting itself which determines how many players it can hold. at this point we would only be repeating ourselves. all the staff here care about is crediting. an author could come back and request removal if they really care enough. you are really starting to overthink this all now and should really just let it go, honestly, ignore him or find a new community. but that's right, all we really got is game maps and the workshop. so you'll just have to get used to it.

"a responsible author would say to disable addons even if there's no conflicts". then what's the point of customizing the game, even having the ability to use addons and site's like this or the workshop. i bet you always think every time you see red in the addon list that anything or everything is a problem? when quite often it's a minor little thing that could be ignored like vpks sharing the same files, like a thumbnail. it's not always that, but I hope you'e also not assuming there's people who don't know how to have a 'clean" addons list.

and the fact that fricken map 2 now actually loads with more than 4 people says enough.

what i meant with "just the 2 of us" was it's just us communicating in this conversation. oh, i also wanted to take it privately because you might have noticed by now we don't get notifications if we didn't start the original comment. so for all we know we're annoying kornfed with constant replies to his post. who knows if he cares, he could find it funny, but just more points to consider. :)

I'm saying that if you customize the game too much you'll run into more problems than normal. I know enough about the game to understand vpks and how addons work, so please dont assume Im ignorant and dont know what im saying. And yes, you'll be surprised to know that there are people who dont know how to have a 'clean' addon list. After all, theres new players to the game everyday. Dont assume that everyone who plays this game knows how it works. If a new players downloads an Axe skin, and plays on a custom map with an Axe skin and he gets errors, when he complains to the author, what would the author say? I never said that people should only play on vanilla. I dont know where you got that from. I only said that you should play custom maps on vanilla to minimize any issues with the map. I understand the importance of customization in this game, if not it would have died off years ago. You dont have to explain entities to me, again dont assume i dont know something. I'm just saying how does Huck know what to and what to not remove when he didnt create the map himself? Plus the fact that he didnt state which entities he removed, how can we trust his judgement given his track record? You're extremely good at dodging and misinterpreting arguments. If you feel that me explaining and coming up with ways to solve the issue here is 'overthinking', then i feel that you're a hypocrite because you yourself said that you do the same thing, minus the solving part.

I'm never saying you are anyhting or you're not, I speak in general. Allow to clear that up first. Sorry for any confusion. That's exactly one of my points, not many will kow how to properly manage addons. But if it helps enough removing unnecessary content out of maps, such as too many entities, it's a step in the right direction. Now in your example, the "axe" in the map would over ride and take priority and that's the axe he'd get. It'd be because the map was most likely the newer download. That is, if it's a texture. But even if it was a model, it's irrelevant. People don't like having custom models and skins included in maps. So it rarely happens. Which puts us back to the main point, we customize the game however we like. Yes, you're over thinking. What does it matter what specific entities are considering it's a mapper thing, most people won't understand wtf they are. There's no dodging or misinterpreting going on here... except from maybe you and some others. You are implying that people should only play a certain way when it comes to custom maps, which I'm sorry, is rather funny. Why limit ourselves with how much we can customize the game, that doesn't make any sense. I say enough considering how most people come here to download the custom content... Yet when I do, you and others twist it around and turn it into a mockery. I could do the same and label those of you as hypocrites because you insist coming here to complain which doesn't help. I think a more definitive stance is there actually ins't one if you go look up Valve's own developer wiki: "Decompiling is the process of taking a compiled map file and generating a file that Hammer can open. Decompiled maps are not perfect recreations, because of format differences. This makes them useful for learning, measurement, and inspection, but not direct recompilation. The original source is ideal for reproductions or modifications. Releasing reproductions, modifications, or approximations of another's work without permission nor credit may be considered rude to the author, is largely frowned upon, and depending on the source of the map, copyright infringement! That said, there are methods of preventing maps from being decompiled, but it isn't worth your time because none of them are 100% effective and 99% of decompilers aren't stealing anyways." So Valve doens't seem to really care that much, if at all, seems more neutral and logical in my opinion. Therefore I doubt it's really that big of a deal to Game Maps and so once more I say it actually is best we let it go and move on. Bottom line, complaining's not going to help or change it. Most will just come to download and either keep it or delete it. Really not that hard, Andre. You said yourself about track record or reputation. We don't know Huck. We don't know what he's learned or hasn't. Why does it bother you so much, seriously. None of you are being forced to download his content especially if it bothers you so much. THAT makes YOU the hypocrites. Very ironic ones. I don't need to explain anything considering the way you treat us here. You even "dodged" my request to take this matter privately just in case an admin comes in to clean it up. You clearly want conversation but what happens when it all gets deleted? I gave you a chance, Andre, are you going to take it? It's fine if you wanted others to participate... but it's obvious it's just us.

Theres no need to take this discussion privately. I wouldnt say its just the two of us reading these walls of texts. "Why limit ourselves with how much we can customize the game, that doesn't make any sense." This. You know the Source engine is ancient and difficult to work with, of course theres limits to how much stuff you can add to it. Sure you can customize the game however you like, but you're doing it at your own risk. Why does it bother me so much? Well for one, I appreciate Huck still working on this game for a decade. You yourself acknowledge theres a drop in quality in the things he uploads, is it wrong of me to ask that to be changed? Considering its one of the driving factors why so many people dislike him. I dont speak for everyone here, so you lumping me with the rest of those who come here and complain for no good reason just so you can use my own words against me is really uncool man. Like you said, Im more civilized and level-headed than others, I really hope the community can start seeing Huck they same way they do to Dave (sorry if i used your name too much). Both of them don't break the rules. Both of them do similar work. And yet they are viewed so differently. I've broken down the reasons why that is so. I wont go on and on about this, trying to make things better here would make me a hypocrite to you.

well another reason i asked to move this else where is something's up with the site and it's putting the replies out of order. but the other still stands. what if the comments do get deleted. i'm fine talking to you, but we can't do that if they're removed. no one said you're wrong wanting a change... but how likely is it going to happen? he's either done all he feels he can or doesn't care and move son to other things. we can't change that. i'm not attacking you for anything or any reason, you definitely took my own words out of context. i'm just trying to understand why it's hard for some of you to see it's obvious there won't be any changes. this is why i say what i do, why i always repeat myself to just let it go and move on. there's no disrespect or dodging to it. the man has been here for almost as long as the game and the staff have already made their stance. like it or not, it's probably not going to change, and complaining certainly isn't helping either. it's fine if you want to try to warn others, but it's not going to stop. decompiling maps has been around since the original Half Life, it's nothing new, at least not here. worry more about the actual thieves that come around here. I just noticed someone trying to steal something of Dave's. you know the real thieves when you see them when they delete the comments from the owners or others calling them out. there isn't even any hostility or toxicity or harassment, they're just trying to hide something. not even Huck would do that. anyway, i just wanted to see if we could have any sort of understanding. thanks for finally acknowledging my private request. maybe still give it more thought. i don't mind communicating to you, but if these comments are cleaned we'll miss something. and like i also said, they're out of order for some reason